# Wiki Meta Discussions
Old discussions: [[WIKIHOMEURLTWikiTWikiDiscussrev120]] | [[WIKIHOMEURLTWikiTWikiDiscussrev144]]
This is an area to talk about how the Hurd Wiki pages are put together, edited and arranged. Without organization the navigation of the site could become unusable.
If you need anything server related done just send me, [[Main/JoachimNilsson]], an email. I'm available almost every waken hour.
Please add your comments below and then your signature, Blog style.
One thing though. Refactor _mercilessly_! :-) [Yes! [[Main/GrantBow]]]
-- [[Main/JoachimNilsson]] - 13 May 2002
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I just saw the GNU head in the mini icon of my mozilla browser URL entry window. Very cool! When did you put that in?
-- [[Main/GrantBow]] - 09 Jan 2003
Not so long ago, I think it was around the 1st Jan.
-- [[Main/JoachimNilsson]] - 11 Jan 2003
Look out, I found a new TWiki goodie on Codev.
Here's [another dangerous idea](http://twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Codev/ShorterURLs) again harping on shorter URLs. Can this be implemented in addition to the current scheme? I'll read closely and try to figure this out for myself as well for my friend who wants a new install.
-- [[Main/GrantBow]] - 10 Jan 2003
Oh, this looks dangerous! I think we should hold off on this until later, preferrably until it is more widely tested and perhaps "recommended" from the installation topics in upcoming releases of TWiki.
You should see the redirects we already have, they are awful.
-- [[Main/JoachimNilsson]] - 11 Jan 2003
Here comes another crazy site-wide idea. I was just looking at the [Webalizer data](http://hurd.gnufans.org/webalizer/). The number of visits is increasing pretty quickly. I also found some [discussion of a Webalizer Plugin](http://twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Codev/WebalizerStatistics) on twiki.org.
A temporary work around I was thinking of doing is edit the [[WebStatistics]] pages for the various webs to link to your Webalizer. Before I do that I wanted to discuss this with you.
For [[Hurd/WebStatistics]] I just edited the topic to include the Webalizer URL in it. Might we be able to help with developing a Webalizer Plugin (or Add-On, whichever is appropriate) for TWiki to solve the general case? I'm ready to check in some stuff to a new module in the CVS you have created for the Gnu Skin on Savannah. I'm willing to learn what it will take. What do you think?
-- [[Main/GrantBow]] - 10 Jan 2003
Sure, we could have the [[WebStatistics]] reference the Webalizer, that could be useful.
Email me your user name on Savannah and I'll add you to the developers list on the twiki-skins project. Setup a topic that we can discuss the plugin on - I might get some time over to work on it as well.
-- [[Main/JoachimNilsson]] - 11 Jan 2003
Here's an idea that seems almost profane at the beginning but is something I'd like to see installed on this site. [Spaced Wiki Word Plugin](http://twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Plugins/SpacedWikiWordPlugin) could be globally disabled, but it's a nice feature for those that would prefer it. Outsiders won't get thrown off by the funny character spacing. This could be very useful in improving adoption. What do you think, Joachim?
Oops, I'm on a rampage! TWiki:Plugins/FindElsewherePlugin too. Both were at least inspired by TWiki:Main/MartinCleaver. Another interesting one might be TWiki:Plugins/SpellCheckAddOn
Oops, oops, look out! TWiki:Plugins/TouchGraphAddOn should be wonderful. Alex (the original TouchGraph author) is also a recent collaborator with Dr. Douglas Engelbart like me! I'm so happy to find this addon exists!
It also sounds like you recreated the TWiki:Plugins/GenHTMLAddon (or newer TWiki:Plugins/PublishAddOn) and almost the TWiki:Plugins/RedirectBySubdomainAddOn out of necessity for the home page.
-- [[Main/GrantBow]] - 13 Jan 2003
If only I could get through to I would take a close look on, at least, the TWiki:Plugins/SpacedWikiWordPlugin. It could sure be useful! The others I have to check out first.
The Wiki2HTML stuff I did a loooong time ago. At the time I worked at and we setup [[WikiMoinMoin]] for the intranet. [[WikiMoinMoin]] is written in Python, so the Wiki2HTML script was done by me and a [Jakob](http://vmlinux.org/jakob) in Python. I did not know of the TWiki plugins, so I simply modified what I had, which is extremely simple and yet powerful. :)
-- [[Main/JoachimNilsson]] - 13 Jan 2003
I'm going in alot of different directions right now, but I get excited when I learn more about what's possible with TWiki. I noticed that the version of [[TWiki/InterwikiPlugin]] uses what will soon be called the old page for [[TWiki/InterWikis]]. Twiki.org has the new one of course. TWiki:TWiki/InterSiteLinkRules. This is a relatively minor in itself.
Yet Peter has also asked me to update a document that is an upgrade instructions and release notes combined. It's at TWiki:TWiki/TWikiUpgradeGuide.
However, this got me thinking, what about an upgrade for ? Feels like alot of trouble. :eek:
I also need to QA this document or get people to help me. :D
P.S. I found two smilies not in the [[SmiliesPlugin]], :-D and >:-)
-- [[Main/GrantBow]] - 15 Jan 2003
I've installed the [[SpacedWikiWordPlugin]] and [[FindElsewherePlugin]]. I'll review the rest of the proposed new plugins later. I'm a bit swamped right now ...
On might think that the :-D should equivalent to :D, but that's not my table. ;-)
Upgrading the Hurd Wiki to the Beijing release sounds like a lot of trouble, yep. I suggest we wait until the storm has settled and all known issues with a transition are ... well, known.
My philosophy is simple; "If it works, don't mess with it!" :)
-- [[Main/JoachimNilsson]] - 15 Jan 2003
[[TWikiBigDiff]]
-- [[Main/JamesAMorrison]]
[[GnuFansW3mTips]]
[[GnuFansEmailDiscuss]] [[GnuFansIRCDiscuss]] [[GnuFansBlogDiscuss]]
[[GnuFansHelpHurdProject]]
I'm also thinking this topic should be renamed to [[GnuFansDiscuss]] someday. :-)
_Why? Since we are addressing the whole site, and we now have a different name for the site rather than TWiki with the new WIKITOOLNAME. Live and learn I guess, would have been nice to have set the identity of the site up front had we known about all the features. I guess that's why I'm interested in helping the TWiki project with documentation. -- [[Main/GrantBow]] - 30 Jan 2003_
-- [[Main/GrantBow]] - 18 Jan 2003
TWiki:Codev/EmailResetPassword is a topic I started about getting this implemented.
-- [[Main/GrantBow]] - 20 Jan 2003
In your copious spare time, TWiki:Plugins/FindElsewherePlugin I think will help users find stuff now that we have moved stuff around. I can go back and delete all the placeholder pages that show up for `hbot` after it's installed!
-- [[Main/GrantBow]] - 30 Jan 2003
Already installed Grant, see [[TWiki/FindElsewherePlugin]]. I'm waaaaaaay ahead of you! :-)
About renaming topics to GnuFans ... what if I or Deego (or someone else) sets up another subdomain on gnufans.org with a wiki on it (I've been thinking about it). Wouldn't that make things a bit confusing? How about using HurdWiki instead?
Maybe the WIKITOOLNAME should be changed as well?
-- [[Main/JoachimNilsson]] - 30 Jan 2003
Joachim, you usually are way ahead of me! I guess I'll have to actually read the documentation for [[TWiki/FindElsewherePlugin]] and here's why: I moved [[Hurd/PortToL4]] to the Trash since it was a simple placeholder for the current [[Mach/PortToL4]]. Then I tried to go to the Hurd web's page and got the same old not found. I thought the purpose of the new plugin was to **_find where it moved,_** isn't it? Like I said, I'll RTFM. (Testing [[PortToL4]])
I'm not clear on what you are proposing about about another TWiki. If we need to change the WIKITOOLNAME again, that's OK, but I wasn't expecting there to be more wikis under gnufans.org. I like that it gives the one big different part of the domain name for the main site when compared with . Since the WIKITOOLNAME is on every page that is really a good thing, reminding users where they are so they can type in the domain name directly the next time they think about our site. We also dont' want a real WikiName for the WIKITOOLNAME. Lesse, what to choose. Maybe "Hurdfans" ? But then I feel this dilutes our efforts to separate the Hurd, Mach and Distrib webs. :-(
If you do, there's mod\_perl vs. standard perl issues to deal with and performance issues. By the way, is Gnufans on mod\_perl now?
P.S. (thinking out loud) I find it kind of odd about wanting to refactor and yet not wanting to remove our previous conversation. I bet other TWiki users have this same need on hot topics, but a wiki isn't as optimally designed for very long rambling conversations as it is for shorter discussions per "topic" and refactoring for later generations to come along. While deleting content is OK given the RCS versioning, I know it's a pain to look in CVS if you don't know what version to look for. Perhaps more opportunities for improving the diff functions or providing an alternative feature for discussion topics.
OK, it's way past my bedtime!
-- [[Main/GrantBow]] - 30 Jan 2003
Well, let's say I was thinking about starting up for the GNU Pico clone. Then I would set the WIKITOOLNAME to Hydrant-Wiki or similar. Not that I have any current plans to actually do this, but it's entirely possible. This is why I from the beginning also setup DNS to provide the and names.
To me the URL really doesn't matter that much, I barely remember the URL's for my own homepage, and I know of people discussing ways to use dynamically generated domain names for sessions keys, like , so I've started ignoring URL's people send me and rely on googling for what I need from time to time ... this is of course completely irrelevant for this discussion so I stop now.
Our Apache installation has always been on mod\_perl drugs, I only found that out myself recently. :)
**_About refactoring,_** I'm not sure what you mean by "not wanting to remove our previous conversation"? Do you mean the links on top, "Old discussions", that I put up some time ago or what? I know I'm usually too lazy to delete old stale discussions or even refactor my own comments - but hey, I'm only human. ;)
-- [[Main/JoachimNilsson]] - 30 Jan 2003
OK, I got it. I posted to TWiki:Plugins/FindElsewherePluginDev just now. Can you modify the oops page templates (oohh, there are alot of them! **_31 of them!_** maybe oopstopicexists.tmpl or oopsmissing.tmpl?) in twiki-safe/templates/ so that [[FindeElsewherePlugin]] can act on an embedded $topic variable? I think you will understand what I mean. I'll describe it just in case: "When I try [[Hurd/PortToL4]] I want to be able to get to [[Mach/PortToL4]] quickly from the 404/oops page. Since [[FindElsewherePlugin]] is installed all that's needed (I think) is to add a $topic to the beginning to allow the plugin to work it's magic. I dont' know what would be best if there are multiple topics in multiple webs."
So many discussion threads, only one topic. Yes, Joachim, we are all human, and that's what I was commenting on. It was on the conflict between the fundamental topic design of any wiki (specifically for you and I here in this topic) and the human condition of wanting to say lots of things about different topics. Perhaps I have a higher scatter thought pattern than most, but I think you understand what I'm saying. ;-) Maybe we should try to catch up on IRC which seems a very much higher bandwidth communication tool than any wiki can be!
P.S. Have you recently changed the default for Release edit lock to be checked? I might have just noticed it for the first time, I'm intrigued by the locking features of TWiki at the moment.
-- [[Main/GrantBow]] - 30 Jan 2003