2 files changed, 124 insertions, 0 deletions
diff --git a/unsorted/HurdWikiCopyrightDiscuss.mdwn b/unsorted/HurdWikiCopyrightDiscuss.mdwn
new file mode 100644
index 00000000..ffa0b17b
--- /dev/null
+++ b/unsorted/HurdWikiCopyrightDiscuss.mdwn
@@ -0,0 +1,69 @@
+How about that notice from [[Main/PeterThoeny]]? Why don't we change the [[Hurd/WebPreferences]] for the Hurd web to say "Copyright (c) 2002 Free Software Foundation", instead of the usual "... the contributing authors". I think that would make the information we put in here easier to move around among different webs (not only Wikified ones...). Perhaps also add a notice on licensing? Like this:
+
+    "Copyright (C) 2001, 2002 Free Software Foundation, Inc.,
+     59 Temple Place - Suite 330, Boston, MA  02111,  USA
+
+     Verbatim copying and distribution of this entire article is
+     permitted in any medium, provided this notice is preserved."
+
+    Submitting material to the Hurd Wiki not only assigns the copyrights
+    to the Free Software Foundation it also put the material itself under
+    the GNU FDL, http://www.gnu.org/licenses/fdl.html
+
+-- [[Main/JoachimNilsson]] - 14 May 2002
+
+Don't do this - the material will not be assigned to the FSF until every contributor signed a paper form and filed it with the FSF.
+
+So simply claiming something is (C) FSF will not make it to be so, and it will not only have no effect, but also be confusing.
+
+Wiki has authentication, this is good. However, unless you have paper forms, all contributions remain with the original author.
+
+And if you had papers, you would have to disallow or moderate guest account contributions and either filter them out or change the copyright notice when they are filled in. This makes reusing Wiki-evolved content in free software projects by the FSF difficult btw, so don't expect major wiki-evolved content to be included in FSF manuals or so (this is not a problem, as long as everyone is aware of this limitation and keeps it in mind).
+
+-- Marcus Brinkmann (no, not a Wiki-Name :)
+
+So what you are saying is basically this:
+
+1. We cannot assign the copyright to the FSF without the _paper_ work.
+2. We _can_ use content from the FSF (as long as we keep all copyright information, of course), but any content evolved from this is unusable for GNU manuals.
+3. Even if every newly registered user (and [[Main/TWikiGuest]] is disabled completely for the Hurd Web) agrees to our terms that agreement is useless without the _paper_ work.
+
+Oh, there is of course all the RCS diffs ... would that help, if we would like to have the Wiki content in GNU manuals?
+
+-- [[Main/JoachimNilsson]] - 14 May 2002
+
+If you have papers signed by the contributors, then any Guest added words (less than 10 lines?) can be filtered out of the Wiki using RCS. This is acceptable for GNU code, if I recall correctly. You may have to re-writen certain portions of the Wiki to use FSF contributed work only, though.
+
+-- [[Main/SimonLaw]] - 16 May 2002
+
+There seems to be a confusion of FDL vis-a-vis copyright-assignment here. FDL is like the all-important Step 1 which protects this content from being non-free. Copyright assignment is an Optional Step 2.
+
+Step2's not being feasible does not mean that we can't take Step 1.
+
+90% of GPL'ed software out there does not take Step 2. Step 2 helps by involving FSF in case someone violates our Step 1--the copyright itself. But i don't see why we cannot take Step 1 atleast.
+
+-- [[Main/DeepakGoel]] - 01 Oct 2002
+
+After an email discussion a while ago now between myself, Grant Bowman, RMS and Marcus Brinkmann the following results where achieved:
+
+* Copyright assignment can indeed be done without the extensive paperwork.
+
+* To implement this on a Wiki some provisions must be fulfilled:
+  * The user must **_actively_** select a checkbox or similar.
+  * The text to the checkbox can be _"I approve to also assign the copyrights of my work to the FSF"_
+
+* This practise can be implemented today in the U.S., but in the EU there are still some things that need to be ironed out. Different countries still have differences in copyright law. However, the Swedish laws, where the Hurd wiki is located, do allow such a practise.
+
+The first step, mentioned above by [[Main/DeepakGoel]] we have now taken. The Hurd wiki is now licensed under the GNU FDL. The second step, assigning copyright will take a bit longer since the Perl scripts making out the TWiki engine must be altered. Also, we must first make sure that we all want to take the second step - we will also need to get the approval of assigning copyright of older material by those editors.
+
+-- [[Main/JoachimNilsson]] - 01 Jan 2003
+
+I don't feel taking the next step of copyright assignment is necessary, but I'm not opposed to it either. My concerns revolve around encouraging a wider participation and not actively putting up more barriers. Not many folks contribute as it is, unfortunately.
+
+-- [[Main/GrantBow]] - 03 Jan 2003
+
+Good, I've been hesitating too. Then there's no need for me to rush into getting the architecture of it working just yet.
+
+As it is right now, with at least the licensing (the FDL) in place, I'm quite content.
+
+-- [[Main/JoachimNilsson]] - 03 Jan 2003
diff --git a/unsorted/HurdWikiMove.mdwn b/unsorted/HurdWikiMove.mdwn
new file mode 100644
index 00000000..084e0ff2
--- /dev/null
+++ b/unsorted/HurdWikiMove.mdwn
@@ -0,0 +1,55 @@
+Many thanks to [[Main/JoachimNilsson]] for his work to establish and help update this Hurd Wiki! You have been extremely kind with your efforts in creating the new GNU skin and all of the expected and unexpected administrative work that's been needed to establish this Wiki.
+
+Now that the site is established, the traffic levels are growing and the value of the site is evident. This will affect the current host since its bandwidth is quite limited. Therefore a new permanent host must be located. We would like it to offer the following:
+
+* Free bandwidth
+* At least one GiB of quota
+* Availability 24/7
+* Shell access for at least one person for administrational purposes
+* Possibly in the U.S. due to "click-n-approve" copyright assignment of material to the FSF (see [[HurdWikiCopyrightDiscuss]]).
+* Regular backups
+* Other?
+
+Comment on this page or email the maintainer <joachim@gnufansNOSPAM.org>
+
+Potential places to move Hurd Twiki to in order of preference:
+
+* savannah.gnu.org
+* Some other \*.gnu.org site
+* Other site in the U.S. or country with similar copyright laws.
+
+----
+
+I favor removing gnu.org from the above list. There are copyright issues that are technically impossible to address in the way that RMS wants copyright assigned to all content hosted on gnu.org. While we probably could bend over backwards to accomodate it, fundamentally I think that this and other potential problems are not worth the effort of making this Hurd Twiki an official part of the GNU project.
+
+Technically I think that savannah.gnu.org might be possible but I will defer to others for a decision from this perspective. Assuming it's possible, I think we may have similar problems as above.
+
+I favor looking for another solution, an "other".
+
+-- [[Main/GrantBow]] - 22 Sep 2002
+
+Refactoring and updating.
+
+The copyright issues we have to straighten out anyway. If someone wants to make a CD set of the "manual" we have created here and that content later on gets misused we need to defend our rights. Using the GNU [[GNU/FreeDocumentationLicense]] and assigning the copyright to the FSF will help us achieve this. The FSF can fight for us instead of all the writers trying to get together.
+
+-- [[Main/JoachimNilsson]] - 23 Oct 2002
+
+Joachim, how are we doing on bandwidth usage? Is it growing, decreasing, about the same? What measure should we be looking at to keep an eye on the situation? I am sure lots of people really appreciate your hosting this site for free. I'm of course one of them!
+
+-- [[Main/GrantBow]] - 01 Jan 2003
+
+I have [the statistics](http://hurd.gnufans.org/webalizer/) under observation and thus far it looks very good. There really isn't much traffic at all, [compared to](http://vmlinux.org/webalizer/) the machine we host gnufans.org on. One tenth of the traffic to vmlinux.org.
+
+Occasionally I talk to one of the guys at [QuickNet](http://www.quicknet.se) about the hosting and our (vmlinux.org's) bandwidth usage. He has assured me that there is no problem at all, in fact, they have increased the overall capacity of their hosting capabilites, so now our traffic is no more than a drop in the ocean to them. :)
+
+I'll keep you (all) informed if there is any change in status of the hosting.
+
+Furthermore, I've been looking into the copyright assignment issues we talked about a while ago now. It seems RMS is right. At least in Sweden transfer of copyright can be made by a user in the way he descibed in the email conversation we had. The provision is that the user must **_actively_** select a checkbox or similar which says something like:
+
+* _"I hereby assign the copyrights of my work to the FSF"_
+
+This means that the copyright is also owned by the FSF, the original author can never lose his rights to a work. The copyright assignment is useful when there is a license violation, bacause then the FSF can fight on behalf of the copyright owners without having to ask them all.
+
+Well, this post somewhat "nullifies" many of the claims made at the beginning of this topic. Maybe I should refactor it a bit to better suit the current circumstances?
+
+-- [[Main/JoachimNilsson]] - 01 Jan 2003